Date: Thu, 16 Jun 1994 06:51:07 -1000 From: johnson@eng.gtefsd.com () Message-Id: <2tpvtr$rna@europa.eng.gtefsd.com> Organization: GTE Federal Systems Division Reply-To: johnson@eng.gtefsd.com (Al Johnson) Subject: Ultra Standoff Problem I have an Ultra which is a great flying kite. I do have one problem though. The standoffs have a tendency to come off in turns. It seems to be a bigger problem flying quadline than dual line. I have lost one already and had to replace it. Does anyone have any thoughts about a cure? Thanks in advance. Al Johnson = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Thu, 16 Jun 1994 09:24:17 -1000 From: jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu (Jeffrey C. Burka) Message-Id: <2tq8t1$fd3@umd5.umd.edu> Organization: University of Maryland, College Park Subject: Re: Ultra Standoff Problem In article <2tpvtr$rna@europa.eng.gtefsd.com> johnson@eng.gtefsd.com (Al Johnson) writes: >I have an Ultra which is a great flying kite. I do have one problem though. >The standoffs have a tendency to come off in turns. It seems to be a bigger >problem flying quadline than dual line. I have lost one already and had to >replace it. Does anyone have any thoughts about a cure? Thanks in advance. You don't say where the standoff is loose on the kite. Is the snap popping off the sail, or is it coming out of the vinyl on the bottom spreader? TC recommends that the standoffs be removed from the kite before storage (most folks tuck them into the leading edge sleeve for safe keeping; the curvature of the spars keeps the standoff from sliding all the way into the sleeve). Personally, I've never had a standoff come off of my Ultra in dual or quad flight, and I tend to be pretty rough on the kite, lots of stalls, axels, and other tricks I probably shouldn't talk about. I *will* say that I accidentally stuck the wrong standoff on one side of my Ultra one day. It was a home-made standoff with a larger snap, and it stretched out the female end on the kite. Now I have to use my own standoff on that side of the kite... Somebody already said that the standoffs should be under compression, and this is correct. Is it possible that your vinyls are sliding along the spreaders, lessening the compression and creating some slack which could cause them to pop out? Jeff -- |Jeffrey C. Burka | "Everything is still with a fear of never coming out | |Suffering Bad Grammar| Never following through / Never ever finishing | |jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu | What we wanted to do." -- Melissa Ferrick | = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Thu, 16 Jun 1994 09:49:58 -1000 From: johnson@eng.gtefsd.com () Message-Id: <2tqad6$t6i@europa.eng.gtefsd.com> Organization: GTE Federal Systems Division Subject: Re: Ultra Standoff Problem In message <2tq8t1$fd3@umd5.umd.edu>, jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu (Jeffrey C. Burka) writes: >In article <2tpvtr$rna@europa.eng.gtefsd.com> johnson@eng.gtefsd.com (Al Johnson) writes: > >>I have an Ultra which is a great flying kite. I do have one problem though. >>The standoffs have a tendency to come off in turns. It seems to be a bigger >>problem flying quadline than dual line. I have lost one already and had to >>replace it. Does anyone have any thoughts about a cure? Thanks in advance. > >You don't say where the standoff is loose on the kite. Is the snap popping >off the sail, or is it coming out of the vinyl on the bottom spreader? > >TC recommends that the standoffs be removed from the kite before storage >(most folks tuck them into the leading edge sleeve for safe keeping; the >curvature of the spars keeps the standoff from sliding all the way into the >sleeve). > >Personally, I've never had a standoff come off of my Ultra in dual or quad >flight, and I tend to be pretty rough on the kite, lots of stalls, axels, >and other tricks I probably shouldn't talk about. > >I *will* say that I accidentally stuck the wrong standoff on one side of my >Ultra one day. It was a home-made standoff with a larger snap, and it >stretched out the female end on the kite. Now I have to use my own >standoff on that side of the kite... > >Somebody already said that the standoffs should be under compression, and >this is correct. Is it possible that your vinyls are sliding along the >spreaders, lessening the compression and creating some slack which could >cause them to pop out? > >Jeff > > > >-- >|Jeffrey C. Burka | "Everything is still with a fear of never coming out | >|Suffering Bad Grammar| Never following through / Never ever finishing | >|jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu | What we wanted to do." -- Melissa Ferrick | Thanks. It comes off the sail. The problem appears to be that it doesn't snap onto the sail tight enough. I do remove them after flying. = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Thu, 16 Jun 1994 07:19:25 -1000 From: ilh@lcs.mit.edu (Lee Hetherington) Message-Id: Organization: MIT/LCS Spoken Language Systems Subject: Re: Ultra Standoff Problem | I have an Ultra which is a great flying kite. I do have one problem | though. The standoffs have a tendency to come off in turns. It seems | to be a bigger problem flying quadline than dual line. I have lost | one already and had to replace it. Does anyone have any thoughts | about a cure? Thanks in advance. How are they currently attached to the sail? My kites have these standoff "paddles" that are sewn or attached with an eyelet to the sail. I then glue the standoff into the paddle. That way I can't lose them. If your standoffs keep popping out, maybe they're too loose. I would think that they should always be in compression, but I'm not too familiar with Ultras. However, I did fly one for an hour last weekend (quadlined), and the standoffs never came out. -- Lee Hetherington ilh@lcs.mit.edu = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Fri, 17 Jun 1994 05:14:01 -1000 From: AhClem0013@aol.com Message-Id: <9406171114.tn54733@aol.com> Organization: Division of Applied Sciences, Harvard University Subject: Re: Ultra Standoff Problem In message <2tq8t1$fd3@umd5.umd.edu>, jeffy@syrinx.umd.edu (Jeffrey C. Burka) writes: >In article <2tpvtr$rna@europa.eng.gtefsd.com> johnson@eng.gtefsd.com (Al Johnson) writes: > >>I have an Ultra which is a great flying kite. I do have one problem though. >>The standoffs have a tendency to come off in turns. It seems to be a bigger >>problem flying quadline than dual line. I have lost one already and had to >>replace it. Does anyone have any thoughts about a cure? Thanks in advance. > >You don't say where the standoff is loose on the kite. Is the snap popping >off the sail, or is it coming out of the vinyl on the bottom spreader? > >TC recommends that the standoffs be removed from the kite before storage >(most folks tuck them into the leading edge sleeve for safe keeping; the >curvature of the spars keeps the standoff from sliding all the way into the >sleeve). > >Personally, I've never had a standoff come off of my Ultra in dual or quad >flight, and I tend to be pretty rough on the kite, lots of stalls, axels, >and other tricks I probably shouldn't talk about. > >I *will* say that I accidentally stuck the wrong standoff on one side of my >Ultra one day. It was a home-made standoff with a larger snap, and it >stretched out the female end on the kite. Now I have to use my own >standoff on that side of the kite... > >Somebody already said that the standoffs should be under compression, and >this is correct. Is it possible that your vinyls are sliding along the >spreaders, lessening the compression and creating some slack which could >cause them to pop out? > >Jeff Since TC copied our system perhaps our solution will work on his kite. We recomend to people who buy Jordan Air Kites to super glue the s/o's in place with a drop of super glue and to leave the s/o in the wing when storing the kite. This has never caused a problem that i know of. Since the snap is a mechanical conection the less wear you put on it (snaping and unsnaping) the longer it will last. Hope this helps. aoxomoxoa = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Date: Fri, 17 Jun 1994 05:19:02 -1000 From: sasaki@das.harvard.edu (Marty Sasaki) Message-Id: Organization: Harvard University OIT/NSD Subject: Re: Ultra Standoff Problem The sail on an Ultra is so tight, I can't imagine standoffs popping out unless something really violent happens, maybe a crash or something. However, I have some tips for standoff's in general. When the fitting on the spreader moves, it changes the tension in the sail and the compression of the standoff. Unless you have a spring loaded standoff (like the EFM/MEFM or early kites that I made) it often pays to keep this fitting in place (once the proper position is determined). I use a bit of electrical tape wrapped around the spreader to keep the spreader in place. I've had this fitting move on my Ultra... To keep standoffs in the Beman paddles (on the sail standoff fittings) use a larger diameter rod. Beman recommends 2mm, 3mm or 1/8 inch rod is nice and snug. Alternatively, you can use a bit of glue. Rubber cement will hold enough to keep the rods from getting lost. Alternatively, place a drop of super glue on the fitting/rod junction after the rod is in place. You should be able to break this joint by scraping the glue off, or by cracking the glue with a pair of pliers, if you need to replace the standoff. The snap fittings found on T.C. Powers' and Dean Jordan's kites can sometimes come loose. A bit of rubber cement will sometimes help them stick a little better. Miguel Rodriguez uses a bunch of really small rubber bands to hold his standoff's in place. I don't know where Miguel gets them but they work well. Simply larks head the rubber band onto the spreader and onto the standoff and you won't lose the standoff. -- Marty Sasaki Harvard University Sasaki Kite Fabrications sasaki@noc.harvard.edu Network Services Division 26 Green Street 617-496-4320 10 Ware Street Jamaica Plain, MA 02130 Cambridge, MA 02138-4002 phone/fax: 617-522-8546 = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =